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    Il problema è sempre prendere consapevolezza del nostro livello e
    agire di conseguenza ...<br>
    Una presa di coscienza sarebbe auspicabile ... Anche le brutte
    sconfitte in questo modo non fanno paura ... <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">Il 11/02/2015 15:26, Salvatore Messina
      ha scritto:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:1374733012.3258450.1423664760954.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com"
      type="cite">
      <div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff;
        font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial,
        Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:14px">
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span
            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3257">Diciamo che senza un
            attacco credibile e veloce con le top 10 del ranking
            mondiale si perde ai punti (al piede) ma si perde.</span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span><br>
          </span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span
            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3258">L'Inghilterra in gioco
            penetrato è ancora più pericolosa dell'Irlanda perché
            possiede giocatori abituati e dal fisico impressionante.
            Oltre a questi, come già detto, ha giocatori velocissimi da
            inserire nei canali aperti. Senza contare il miglior gioco
            al piede del 6 Nazioni su tutti i tre livelli verticali
            (mediano - apertura - estremo).</span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span
            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3459">Touch e mischia poi
            sono così avanti che non possiamo nemmeno paragonarci a
            loro...</span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span><br>
          </span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span
            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3380">Purtroppo temo che lo
            staff tecnico italiano con loro tornerà anche a contestare
            la palla (sbagliando e dando ascolto alle critiche a
            vanvera) e verremo infilati negli spazi della linea.</span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span><br>
          </span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span
            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3289">Ci salveremo solo se
            terranno il freno tirato in vista degli impegni di
            campionato e delle prossime partite. Teniamo conto che un
            attacco pericoloso e veloce come quello gallese non ha fatto
            un metro. Il nostro poi....</span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span><br>
          </span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span
            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3347">Giochiamo con trentenni
            passati e i giovani sono anagraficamente a metà carriera....
            A parte Parisse (altissimo livello), Ghiraldini e Minto gli
            altri non sono adatti a questo livello.</span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr"><span><br>
          </span></div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3249" dir="ltr">Respireremo
          aria grama fino al 2015 e poi, volenti o nolenti, il
          giocattolo sarà rotto e dovremo ricominciare da 10 anni fa.
          Avendo però perso nel frattempo tutti i treni possibili...</div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3248"> </div>
        <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3245">
          <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3244">Salvatore Messina</div>
        </div>
        <br>
        <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue,
          Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;"
          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3261">
          <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue,
            Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size:
            16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3260">
            <div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3259"> -----
              Messaggio inoltrato -----<br>
              <font id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3515" face="Arial"
                size="2"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Da:</span></b>
                Luca Oliva <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lucaoliver63@gmail.com">&lt;lucaoliver63@gmail.com&gt;</a><br>
                <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">A:</span></b>
                <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:rugbylist@rugbylist.it">rugbylist@rugbylist.it</a> <br>
                <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Inviato:</span></b>
                Mercoledì 11 Febbraio 2015 11:19<br>
                <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Oggetto:</span></b>
                Re: [RUGBYLIST] I: SECONDO VOI<br>
              </font> </div>
            <div class="y_msg_container"
              id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3517"><br>
              <div id="yiv3889109507">
                <div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3516"> Quindi
                  secondo te impiegando 2-3 giocatori per fermare il
                  portatore ci era impossibile contendere il pallone sul
                  break-down perchè avremmo sguarnito la linea ?<br
                    clear="none">
                  Interessante spiegazione, questo induce a pensare che
                  non sia stata una scelta tattica ma una necessità ...<br
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                  Non vedo come risolvibilile contro l'Inghilterra ...<br
                    clear="none">
                  <br clear="none">
                  Ciao.<br clear="none">
                  Luca <br clear="none">
                  <br clear="none">
                  <div class="yiv3889109507moz-cite-prefix">Il
                    11/02/2015 10:42, Salvatore Messina ha scritto:<br
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                  </div>
                  <blockquote type="cite"
                    id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3519">
                    <div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br>
                      <br>
                    </div>
                    <div class="yiv3889109507yqt9018579939"
                      id="yiv3889109507yqt25550">
                      <div
                        style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue,
                        Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande,
                        sans-serif;font-size:14px;"
                        id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3518">
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span
id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7152">La contesa sul punto
                            d'incontro è una scelta che va fatta solo in
                            alcuni casi ed a condizione di farla bene e
                            mantenere la copertura della linea. Al
                            massimo un giocatore ed un eventuale
                            sostegno. Effettivamente implica la rinuncia
                            ad una o due guardie ma se la palla è
                            contesa, in caso di mantenimento del
                            possesso da parte dell'avversario, la fase
                            successiva difficilmente verrà giocata
                            veloce ai lati del raggruppamento.</span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span><br
                              clear="none">
                          </span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span
id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7286">La difesa in piedi
                            italiana è stata da manuale: completa ed in
                            avanzamento. Nemmeno Francia e Inghilterra
                            sono state così brave (sono dovute ricorrere
                            al fuorigioco sistematico del centro di
                            linea). Il difetto sta nel fatto che ad ogni
                            penetrazione si era obbligati a raddoppiare
                            o addirittura triplicare il placcatore.
                            Questo costringeva ben 2 o 3 difensori a
                            ripiazzarsi in linea dando la possibilità
                            agli irlandesi di penetrare con mantenimento
                            del possesso perchè, pur impiegando molti
                            uomini in ruck erano sempre in parità. In
                            zona due del campo iniziavano a calciare su
                            un triangolo allargato che aveva un solo
                            giocatore su tre in grado di riguadagnare
                            terreno al piede (McLean) e gli altri due
                            solo palla portata o al massimo up&amp;under
                            su se stessi (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!). Manchiamo
                            anche di velocisti, di conseguenza nessuna
                            freccia su cambio d'angolo.</span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span><br
                              clear="none">
                          </span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span
id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_8140">In soldoni: loro
                            giocavano tranquilli perché sapevano di
                            tenere palla e quando ne perdevano il
                            possesso noi non avremmo creato problemi e
                            nella maggior parte dei casi gliela
                            riconsegnavamo a loro, nemmeno in red zone.
                            Per male che fosse andata facevano punti con
                            i calci di punizione perché dopo 10/15 fasi
                            gli italiani avrebbero messo le mani in ruck
                            per disperazione.</span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span><br
                              clear="none">
                          </span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><span
id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_8141">Il gioco moderno
                            richiede fisico e velocità. A parte Parisse,
                            Minto e Ghiraldini noi giochiamo con la
                            mischia che cammina ed in attacco, su difese
                            di alto livello ed avanzanti, significa, nel
                            nostro caso specifico, giocare in 10 contro
                            15.</span></div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><br
                            clear="none">
                        </div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144">Però
                          è una bella "ammuina" che serve per gli spot
                          pubblicitari...</div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144">Almeno
                          nelle pubblicità la federazione sa che "per
                          giocare nella nostra squadra bisogna essere
                          forti ma anche VELOCI"...</div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144">Magari

                          inserissero un programma di sviluppo della
                          velocità nelle giovanili fornendo tecnici
                          specializzati alle società di base che fanno
                          minirugby....</div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><br
                            clear="none">
                        </div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144">O
                          finanziassero programmi tipo Rugbytots e
                          similari....</div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><br
                            clear="none">
                        </div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144">Gli
                          inglesi sono pesanti. Sempre che non si
                          riposino per il turno in Premiership apriranno
                          la nostra difesa in linea per poi lanciare i
                          velocisti negli intervalli. Masi lo conoscono
                          e lo faranno correre per isolarlo e recuperare
                          palla. In mischia ordinata faranno sfogare i
                          due argentini nostri per tenere la loro prima
                          linea mobile ed in fiato per muovere poi palla
                          in penetrazione.</div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144"><br
                            clear="none">
                        </div>
                        <div dir="ltr"
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7144">L'unico

                          dubbio rimane sulle dichiarazioni che
                          rilascerà il nostro presidente (a parte quanti
                          giocatori comprerà per Zebre/Calvisano)....</div>
                        <div
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7141"> </div>
                        <div
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7288">
                          <div
                            id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7287">Salvatore
                            Messina</div>
                        </div>
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                        <div
                          id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7291"
                          style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica
                          Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande,
                          sans-serif;font-size:14px;">
                          <div
                            id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7290"
                            style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica
                            Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande,
                            sans-serif;font-size:16px;">
                            <div dir="ltr"
                              id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7289">
                              ----- Messaggio inoltrato -----<br
                                clear="none">
                              <font
                                id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7292"
                                face="Arial" size="2"> <b><span
                                    style="font-weight:bold;">Da:</span></b>
                                Luca Oliva <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                  rel="nofollow" shape="rect"
                                  class="yiv3889109507moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
ymailto="mailto:lucaoliver63@gmail.com" target="_blank"
                                  href="mailto:lucaoliver63@gmail.com">&lt;lucaoliver63@gmail.com&gt;</a><br
                                  clear="none">
                                <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">A:</span></b>
                                <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
                                  shape="rect"
                                  class="yiv3889109507moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
ymailto="mailto:rugbylist@rugbylist.it" target="_blank"
                                  href="mailto:rugbylist@rugbylist.it">"rugbylist@rugbylist.it"</a>
                                <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
                                  shape="rect"
                                  class="yiv3889109507moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
ymailto="mailto:rugbylist@rugbylist.it" target="_blank"
                                  href="mailto:rugbylist@rugbylist.it">&lt;rugbylist@rugbylist.it&gt;</a>
                                <br clear="none">
                                <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Inviato:</span></b>
                                Domenica 8 Febbraio 2015 10:31<br
                                  clear="none">
                                <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Oggetto:</span></b>
                                Re: [RUGBYLIST] SECONDO VOI<br
                                  clear="none">
                              </font> </div>
                            <div class="yiv3889109507y_msg_container"
                              id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7293"><br
                                clear="none">
                              <div id="yiv3889109507">
                                <div
                                  id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7294">Nello

                                  specifico della partita,
                                  abbiamo "sgomberato" i punti
                                  d'incontro per avere più difensori
                                  nello spazio, in questo modo abbiamo
                                  lasciato l'iniziativa all'Irlanda nel
                                  gioco aperto. Non avendo avuto una
                                  mischia preponderante e essendo stati
                                  surclassati in touche, questo
                                  praticamente ha voluto dire non avere
                                  palloni da giocare per tutta la
                                  partita.
                                  <div
                                    id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7295">Questa
                                    è una scelta precisa dello staff
                                    tecnico che può essere cambiata già
                                    dalla prossima partita con
                                    l'Inghilterra: mettere uno o due
                                    grilli-talpa in più nei punti di
                                    break-down per contestare il
                                    possesso e recuperare palloni.
                                    Questo comporta naturalmente di
                                    "perdere" 1-2 uomini fuori, ed è una
                                    scelta che è già stata scartata dal
                                    ns staff per avere più efficacia
                                    difensiva. Staremo a vedere ...</div>
                                  <div
                                    id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7305"><br
                                      clear="none">
                                  </div>
                                  <div
                                    id="yiv3889109507yui_3_16_0_1_1423642570113_7296">In
                                    generale, il ns rimane un movimento
                                    in grado di produrre alcuni buoni
                                    giocatori che giocano all'estero, ma
                                    non un quantitativo sufficiente per
                                    competere ad alto <span></span>livello.
                                    In questo senso, le sconfitte più
                                    gravi non sono quelle della prima
                                    squadra, che possono essere
                                    "drogate" dal lavoro su un
                                    gruppo super-professionalizzato, ma
                                    quelle delle rappresentative
                                    giovanili. La sconfitta 40-13 della
                                    nazionale Under 20 nel pantano di
                                    Biella è molto più indicativa. È lì
                                    che meglio si apprezzano le
                                    differenze a livello di costruzione
                                    e di formazione dei giocatori.  </div>
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                                  </div>
                                  <div
                                    id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3520">In
                                    sintesi, il livello del ns movimento
                                    attuale NON È da top ten mondiale.
                                    Dovremmo prima di tutto rendercene
                                    conto, e fare un bagno di umiltà.
                                    Dopo di che, forse, si può
                                    ripartire. </div>
                                  <div><br clear="none">
                                  </div>
                                  <div>Ciao.</div>
                                  <div>Luca Oliva</div>
                                  <div
                                    id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3521"><br
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                                  </div>
                                  <div
                                    class="yiv3889109507qtdSeparateBR"><br
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                                  <div
                                    class="yiv3889109507yqt8883362118"
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                                    <div
                                      id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3525">Il
                                      domenica 8 febbraio 2015, Giovanni
                                      Sonego &lt;<a
                                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                                        rel="nofollow" shape="rect"
                                        ymailto="mailto:giovanni@sonego.net"
                                        target="_blank"
                                        href="mailto:giovanni@sonego.net">giovanni@sonego.net</a>&gt;

                                      ha scritto:<br clear="none">
                                      <blockquote
                                        class="yiv3889109507gmail_quote"
                                        style="margin:0 0 0
                                        .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                                        solid;padding-left:1ex;"
                                        id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3524">
                                        <div
                                          id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3523">
                                          <div
                                            id="yui_3_16_0_1_1423662945608_3522">Giovanni
                                            Ciraolo ha scritto il
                                            07/02/2015 alle 21:50:<br
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                                          </div>
                                          <blockquote type="cite">
                                            <div
                                              class="yiv3889109507MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;">Chi potrebbe lavorare sul dettaglio a mio
                                                parere è l’ex-superiore
                                                di Brunel, cioè Bernard
                                                Laporte. Più si va
                                                avanti e più mi convinco
                                                che uno come lui
                                                potrebbe riorganizzare
                                                il nostro rugby.</span></div>
                                          </blockquote>
                                          <br clear="none">
                                          E' proprio qui che ti voglio.
                                          Un buon allenatore di
                                          nazionale può rinnovare il
                                          gioco, portare idee e far
                                          ottenere dei risultati alla
                                          nazionale, ma non può
                                          riorganizzare il nostro rugby.
                                          Io sono sempre piu' convinto
                                          che la nazionale sia
                                          rappresentativa del movimento
                                          rugbyistico di un determinato
                                          paese. Nazioni che hanno un
                                          rugby forte, producono
                                          nazionali forti. Nazioni che
                                          hanno un movimento debole,
                                          producono nazionali deboli. Il
                                          nostro movimento rugbyistico
                                          forte non è di sicuro, se
                                          comparato con quello delle
                                          nazionali al vertice mondiale.
                                          E infatti le nostre nazionali
                                          fanno cagare. <br
                                            clear="none">
                                          <br clear="none">
                                          Cercare l'allenatore
                                          risolutore di tutti i
                                          problemi, il mago che con un
                                          colpo di bacchetta e uno di
                                          culo fa vincere un gruppo di
                                          professionisti che giocano
                                          all'estero puo' contribuire a
                                          dare un po' di diffusione
                                          mediatica. E' proprio questo
                                          il principio su cui mi sembra
                                          storicamente ispirata la
                                          gestione della federazione.
                                          Cerchiamo di ottenere i
                                          risultati della nazionale e
                                          sull'onda dell'entusiasmo
                                          arriveranno un sacco di
                                          praticanti e costruiremo un
                                          movimento solido. Bella
                                          genialata. Sono 15 anni e i
                                          risultati sono quelli che
                                          sono. Sarebbe anche ora che
                                          qualcuno se ne rendesse conto
                                          e che si cominciasse a
                                          rivedere questo approccio
                                          fallimentare.<br clear="none">
                                          <br clear="none">
                                          (Ecco cosa intendevo affermare
                                          dicendo che anche Brunel è
                                          incolpevole)<br clear="none">
                                          <br clear="none">
                                          Ciao<br clear="none">
                                          Giovanni Sonego<br
                                            clear="none">
                                          <br clear="none">
                                        </div>
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                                id="yiv3889109507yqt21354">__________________________________________<br
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                                Gestisci la tua iscrizione<br
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                    <pre>__________________________________________
Gestisci la tua iscrizione
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" class="yiv3889109507moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" href="http://www.rugbylist.it/mailman/options/rugbylist">http://www.rugbylist.it/mailman/options/rugbylist</a>        
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              <br>
              <div class="yqt9018579939" id="yqt05180">__________________________________________<br
                  clear="none">
                Gestisci la tua iscrizione<br clear="none">
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                  href="http://www.rugbylist.it/mailman/options/rugbylist"
                  target="_blank">http://www.rugbylist.it/mailman/options/rugbylist</a>   
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      <pre wrap="">__________________________________________
Gestisci la tua iscrizione
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.rugbylist.it/mailman/options/rugbylist">http://www.rugbylist.it/mailman/options/rugbylist</a>        
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